Oscuro

The Contradictions of Battery Operated Vehicles | Graham Conway | TEDxSanAntonio

TEDx Talks
Suscribirse
Vistas 3 165 247
100% 69 000 0

NOTE FROM TED: This talk only reflects the speaker's personal views and interpretation. Several claims in this talk lack scientific support. We've flagged this talk because it falls outside the content guidelines TED gives TEDx organizers. TEDx events are independently organized by volunteers. The guidelines we give TEDx organizers are described in more detail here: storage.ted.com/tedx/manuals/t...

This talk will challenge the popular perception that Battery Electric Vehicles (BEVs) are environmentally friendly, and will argue that we are inappropriately rushing the market introduction of these vehicles. BEVs are commonly sold under the guise of being ‘Zero Emissions,’ an assertion that is not true by any definition. Brake pads produce emissions, as do
tires and even interiors under sunlight. The electricity that powers BEVs is generated by power plants, 64% of which burn fossil fuels in the U.S.-fossil fuels that contribute to greenhouse gas emissions and global warming. Even more importantly, there are significant CO2 emissions
created during the manufacture of the battery pack, meaning that in order to offset the carbon created during the production process, a BEV must drive 40,000 - 100,000 miles before being environmentally comparable to a gasoline-powered vehicle. Hybrid vehicles, on the other hand,
which combine much smaller batteries with efficient internal combustion engines, have been shown to be a much better option for lowering global CO2. Unfortunately, they do not receive the same marketable ‘kudos’ or policy backing as full BEVs. We are headed down the wrong path by
rolling out BEVs before making the manufacturing and electricity generation CO2 neutral. Dr. Graham Conway is a Principal Engineer in the Automotive Division at Southwest Research Institute. For the last ten years he has been immersed in evaluating automotive technologies and consulting for car companies and suppliers. This gives him unique insights and perspectives on the industry. He is passionate about making vehicles more efficient to ensure the future of the planet and has a message to share about some common misconceptions about electric and non-electric vehicles. This talk was given at a TEDx event using the TED conference format but independently organized by a local community. Learn more at www.ted.com/tedx

Publicado el

 

30 ene 2020

Compartir:

Compartir:

Descargar:

Cargando.....

Añadir:

Mi lista de reproducción
Ver despues
Comentarios 19 878
Yann Camus BlissClimbing
Don't forget. It makes more sense from a green perspective to keep your old car running and well-maintained as long as you can. There are significant environmental costs to both manufacturing a new automobile and adding your old car to the ever-growing collective junk heap.
NotMyActualName
NotMyActualName Hace 2 días
@SirDetMist have you ever driven one? There super nice actually. You won't be able to buy a gas car in twenty years, not because they'll be banned but because so few people will want one that they'll be unprofitable to manufacture
SirDetMist
SirDetMist Hace 2 días
@NotMyActualName No, the fact is electric cars are shite.
Karl Günter Wünsch
@Jae White You are talking about Lead starter batteries in ICE cars, not Lithium Ion batteries, in most chemistries there isn't even a single atom of sulphur in the whole battery pack...
Jae White
Jae White Hace 5 días
@NotMyActualName modern diesel systems are cleaner then natural gas vehicles
Jae White
Jae White Hace 5 días
@Karl Günter Wünsch except batteries also offgas, they just release sulphuric oxide instead of carbon. I think that sounds like a bigger environmental threat. There is a reason batteries have vent tubes
Mike V
Mike V Hace 2 días
Great presentation, and I agree with an overall point being made here about considering CO2 emissions from pre-production to end of life for products. However, the data assumes gasoline is magically in our tanks; the graph represents CO2 emissions from burning the gasoline; but, he did not expand his box for the conventional car in the same way he did for the electric car. He accounts for both their car-production CO2 "penalties", but only accounts for CO2 emissions in the creation of electricity (an electric car's "fuel"), that is, coal harvesting and burning, for example. He does not account for the CO2 emissions from creating gasoline (i.e., harvesting and oil refinement). As a result, car production CO2 values are included for all types of vehicles, but CO2 emissions from "fuel" production is only included for the electric vehicle types. Now I know there's a big hole we can down here regarding CO2 emissions from their respective "fuel" creations (e.g. transportation, infrastructure, etc) I'm just speaking in general terms. If you did it for electricity, should do a basic inclusion on the gasoline side (oil refinery)
John Dough
John Dough Hace un día
What about the CO2 emissions of the cargo ships to transport the oil/minerals/materials/batteries across the world. The CO2 emissions in manufacturing solar panels and wind turbines? The CO2 emissions of importing oil from other countries that cannot produce it as efficiently as the US or Canada? Until Cargo ships, trains, and semi trucks are electric, how is forcing people in the United States to drive electric cars withing the next 10 years going to save the world? Especially when our infrastructure is no where near being close to being able to support such a rapid change. And that's not even mentioning the disposal of all these batteries and such when they've exceeded their usefulness.
M. Merriman
M. Merriman Hace 2 días
Yes, from the prep at the drilling site, the C02 injection during fracking, the leaking at the well-head, energy costs to transport through pipeline, to refinery efficiency, through pipeline to storage, and then via diesel trucks to filling stations there is a lot of unaccounted for GHG emissions in the upstream for fossil fuels.
Mitchell McClure
Mitchell McClure Hace un día
I have a Chevrolet Volt...a "series hybrid" for my daily commute, so I purchase about 17 gallons of gasoline per year. It's far and away more effecient than any "parallel hybrid". These types of cars are what should have been pushed into production while we wait for "full EV" technology to catch up.
Andrew Earle
Andrew Earle Hace 24 días
This reinforces my belief around the importance of buying less, but when we do buy, buying the most durable/quality products on the market and then taking care of them for maximum life.
Sebastian Tysler
Sebastian Tysler Hace 6 días
@J4Zonian but no one would care anyway because we live in capitalistic society where everyone cares only about money. And that will be the end of all of us.
Andrew Earle
Andrew Earle Hace 15 días
@J4Zonian Agreed that riding bicycles, public transit, and walking are key. I support making cities more bicycle friendly, it is such a win. Also, agree on sharing, renting, and leasing. Do you have any research that supports "EVs pay off the $, energy & carbon costs of their construction in an average of 2 years compared to ICEVS, & of course even old EVs keep getting cleaner as the grids that power them get cleaner, which they are, though too slowly." Also, do you know much about recycling EV batteries?
David Ladd
David Ladd Hace 22 días
I suspect every figure mentioned (got your attention?), but I applaud the presentation. When this audience (us) has assimilated this information, they will be able to at least challenge others. Awareness of the complexity of the equation is a step in the right direction. Battery technology, materials acquisition, and manufacturing efficiency are all in flux, on the steep part of the learning curve. The same can be said for solar cells (an non-PV solar). I would like to see more information on thermal issues, such as comparing incident solar radiation absorbed/reflected off into space, on various bare soils, or crops VS. absorbed/reflected off into space by solar farms. PV solar cells absorb a lot of heat that is not reflected and is not converted into electricity. It might turn out that some crops are so good at absorbing CO2 and solar radiation they they could provide more benefit per acre/hectare, as a PV farm. We won’t know until we know, you know? Keep digging!
Jason D
Jason D Hace 2 meses
It takes a lot of energy to produce these vehicles, so hold onto your vehicles longer, your clothes, phones etc longer. However, big companies don’t want this to happen.
Michael Dickins
Michael Dickins Hace 5 días
also what does elon musk 7 other companies have in car eneny requirement troubles, though & even as fact such soalr panels can be fitted in cars, juts no guts yet!!
weezilla
weezilla Hace 17 días
After 13000 miles a tesla creates less CO2 than a gas vehicle after factoring in lifecycle co2.
《KiNG》
《KiNG》 Hace 20 días
They PURPOSELY build and make things that break down in specific ways. So they HAVE to be replaced every 3-5 years
TELCO MANNIX
TELCO MANNIX Hace 20 días
To produce ELECTRICITY, WE MUST BURN COAL or, ATOMIC ENERGY ANYONE?
James Powell
James Powell Hace un mes
We need to be developing and building 4th generation nuclear power plants. Eventually, the technologies for renewable energy will be the future but right now we need to get away from burning carbon based fuels as quickly as possible.
Gianfranco Benetti-Longhini
Something different to make us think rather than just accept. In many countries there are already national blackouts, and both construction and farming machines among others, require a lot of power, and these should also be included in the picture for the future.
Karl Snow
Karl Snow Hace un mes
You will go crazy with the cost and time spent to buy food and wait for highway and construction projects if battery power is required for heavy and agricultural equipment.
Scott Fet
Scott Fet Hace 13 días
Very enjoyable talk. I would like to know when comparing then two vehicles you didn’t include the energy/CO2 produced from the gas that was needed to propel the gas powered vehicles into your calculations? Thanks again.
Karl Günter Wünsch
It was a wrong talk 2 years ago, leaving out important aspects and it has aged as well as a bottle of fresh milk outside the fridge would over the same time...
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 6 días
@Scott Fet I appreciate the point but why is this post identical to numerous others including the misspelling?
captainwho1
captainwho1 Hace 10 días
Probably cancels out in for the case of electricity produced by 60% coal and nat. gas source.
Donald Nasca
Donald Nasca Hace 27 días
I agree with your evaluation. You lack one important part which I think you could and should add. This is the CO2 required to produce solar and wind farms and again to recycle or dispose of them when they age out. This data needs to be considered as many climate deniers use this in their reasoning.
joe dirt
joe dirt Hace 27 días
in australia they want to put wind farm blades in the tip , not recycle them . its there cheapest solution
Anthony Bluhm
Anthony Bluhm Hace 27 días
And rightly so
Dan Bieck
Dan Bieck Hace 7 meses
He makes great points! BUT "renewable sources" of energy still produce a HUGE about of waste and are damaging to the environment. If we would encourage Nuclear power as the main source of power, the amount of effect on the environment would be by far the lowest.
brimstone brimstone
The only downside of nuclear is that you can end up with a Chernobyl or Fukushima disaster, or something worse.
Tony Duncan
Tony Duncan Hace un mes
@jimmy76103 nobody died Three Mile Island and there's no way that we would build a nuclear power plant like Chernobyl
jimmy76103
jimmy76103 Hace un mes
@Tony Duncan tell that to the people around 3 mile island, Chernobyl, and Fukushima. I'm willing to bet they won't agree with you on nuclear being so safe.
Zoran Jovanovic
Zoran Jovanovic Hace un mes
@DudeLF Maybe because of the politics? The need for a global solution would imply global access to the knowledge and materials necessary to produce the nuclear bomb.
Nate Peace
Nate Peace Hace un mes
Word up Dan Biek!!! I always thought Nuclear everything would be fantastic!
Adrian Nitu
Adrian Nitu Hace 4 días
There is a huge amount data missing from his calculation : the battery gets produces one time and that has a cost in CO2 emission, but what he leaves intentionally out of the calculation is the cost of the gasoline production each day! And that is an enormous amount of CO2: Extraction of oil, Shipping and transportation Chemical treatment and transformation. Put this in your calculations and see the balance change!
Brian Zeiger
Brian Zeiger Hace 20 días
Great presentation but there is an important point that is missed. If we "pushed the green button", our antiquated power grid with it's centralized generation wouldn't be able to handle the added customer demand due to all the vehicle charging. Rapid adoption of EVs and their associated charging stations can actually drive faster adoption of solar, wind, and battery storage systems due to the financial picture of utility upgrades vs install of renewables. Renewable resources and battery storage can help "flatten the curve" of utility peak demand. In short, rapid change to EVs = more rapid change to a decentralized power grid which should really be our end goal.
Nola Jacob
Nola Jacob Hace 17 días
@dallasbrat81 That 'rebate' means SOMEONE ELSE is paying for you. The Govt doesn't have any money except what it takes from another taxpayer. You also have to calculate road tax as Govt will have to replace the revenue lost from gasoline sales.
dallasbrat81
dallasbrat81 Hace 18 días
@Rick DeVuyst ok how much Kw ? Nego with the guy. Govt gives you like 26% rebate so I finance about 37k over 20yrs at 1.9% for about $167 mth power verses $450 mth
Rick DeVuyst
Rick DeVuyst Hace 18 días
@dallasbrat81 Locally, it is $70K to solar power a house. I love the idea of photovoltaics, but its just not affordable, nor practical, IMO.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 19 días
@dallasbrat81 Sorry but what makes you think anyone is passing any bill that does anything good? Sounds like it would be nice, though. If only... See you on the other side of the apocalypse.
MrPjn86
MrPjn86 Hace 20 días
Love how he talks about the production or Co2 for electric production and where the electricity comes from but forgets that fuel comes from magical pumps on each corner not just the Co2 from the tailpipe. As he said have to look outside the box, so look outside the box and include the production of fuel. This negates his whole argument.
Karl Günter Wünsch
@Ron C It more than negates the whole point, the box for the gasoline would need to include 42 kWh of additional energy for every 6 litres of fuel - half of that in electricity which comes from either the very same grid he based his errant calculations on or worse comes from diesel powered generators which have an even worse footprint). So to get 6 litres of fuel Well to Tank the oil industry spends around 20 kWh of electricity - which would allow the EV to drive the same distance the ICE car would be able by burning the fuel. So that shifts the balance completely towards the EV and the ICE shows it's true horrendous colors by requiring 22 kWh of additional energy (mostly burnt crude oil when heating the crude oil during pumping and refining) and the total waste of 6 litres of fuel.
Daniël De Keyser
Daniël De Keyser Hace 14 días
@Matt Gayle that's because he made a mistake explaining it: the grass is the "fuel" for the horse, so when using grass-fuel, you can easily recapture the CO2, you can remake the fuel .. it's not just an exploitation of available (and non-renewable) fuel, in contrast with the other fuels discussed.
Matt Gayle
Matt Gayle Hace 15 días
Did anyone notice that when the horse released co2 that the grass took it in and that was shown as "good". But when the corvette released co2, for some reason that was special co2 that couldn't be used by the grass...it just went up into the atmosphere and is bad. Even though horse co2 was said to be equal to corvette co2.
Ron C
Ron C Hace 15 días
I wouldn't say it negates but good point. It certainly needs to be included. He left out a lot of production process on both sides.
John Fitzmaurice
John Fitzmaurice Hace 16 días
@mojo schmee But he is not just talking about just producing a vehicle, he is talking about how far you have to drive the vehicle to break even. Driving requires energy. Crude oil has to be extracted from the ground. That process releases CO2. Crude oil has to be transported to an oil refinery. That process releases CO2. Refining oil into gasoline releases CO2. Transporting gasoline across the ocean or to a gas station releases CO2. Pumping gas releases CO2. The gas station requires electricity to operate. All of the previous processes require a tremendous amount of electricity from power plants or diesel generators which in turn releases CO2. That is the box that a gas powered car is in. I agree that it is not simply how much CO2 is released from the tailpipe. It is how much CO2 is released before the energy is put in the tank plus what is released from the tailpipe.
Liraco
Liraco Hace 19 días
Love that this had to be "fact checked". Wonder what an updated talk would look like in numbers.
Tore Lund
Tore Lund Hace 4 días
@Karl Günter Wünsch Watch the video you are commenting under! At best they are 20% better! EVs are not going to fulfill their potential if we don't sort the energy sector.
Karl Günter Wünsch
@Tore Lund Current lifetime analysis have shown the BEV to be 89% better than comparable ICE cars…
Tore Lund
Tore Lund Hace 4 días
@Karl Günter Wünsch Please you are off here. Regenerative breaking saves on hills and around 20% in city driving. An EV is not 90% efficient. A model 3 is 72% efficient from socket to tyres at highway speed 65mph according to EPA figures. The numbers are right there in the official documentation. Also Comparing efficiency of a combustion engine is not simply taking the energy content in gasoline and Oxygen and magically convert it to electricity! Physics does not work like that. The Carnot efficiency of an an engine working on temperature differential, can theoretically not have a higher efficiency than 65% Heat is a a high entropy energy source, and electricity is a low entropy one, so you are comparing apples and oranges. What is important is emissions, and the EV wins there, but over all, an EV less efficient than a combustion engine. Remember a wind turbine is only 60% efficient and solar panels 22%, so more energy is lost when making an EV go than simply pumping oil and refining it. There is a reason why it has been a long process quitting the oil addiction. NB.: It also depends where you live and why you drive an EV: In the US Grid emissions are 455g CO2/kWh, so if you drive a model 3 there, you emit 160g CO2 per mile or as much as a small Diesel engined car. If you are in Norway with 98% renewables, your consciousness is clean, but there are too many peole expressing their opinion on EVs who have no idea of how reality works.
Karl Günter Wünsch
@Tore Lund You would be correct if they used the same crude way as ICE cars to break. Unfortunately for your argument they use regenerative breaking through their motors which recovers around 80% of the movement energy back into usable electricity. Your maths are woefully wrong through as to be on par with the tesla the ICE car would need to be using only half a litre of petrol over the same distance.
Tore Lund
Tore Lund Hace 9 días
@John Fitzmaurice I has too, currently $8.40 per gallon, but electricity has wilder swings and the overhead fast chargers add, is sometimes excessive. AC charging is reasonable and always around half price of gas per mile. You can also put it another way: A smaller or more efficient EV brings greater reductions per car it replaces, so it becomes both easier to make them, and the effect of each EV becomes more significant.
John Oliver
John Oliver Hace un mes
Excellent presentation, but I still wonder why nuclear is never part of the solution. There is nothing remotely close to it in clean energy production, and over all the years we've used it, very little damage has occurred, and always when safety protocols were ignored. I would love to see the graphs with nuclear energy used. Oh, and we also have reactors now that can reuse the waste, producing basically no nuclear waste. Why not?
Dan Harold
Dan Harold Hace 13 días
@David Humphrey Agree with you but for one point. I have confidence that we will evolve battery storage to where we do not need nuclear power. Not saying we should not use it. See it as an option.
Christian Lisa Beau
Christian Lisa Beau Hace 13 días
I would agree with you on all of it but why not because it overlooks the problem of the fallible human condition, and the damage we can do with this is far worse than the damage we could do with anything else. Because of our human nature.
Dan Harold
Dan Harold Hace un mes
@Dean G How so ?
Dean G
Dean G Hace un mes
@seguefischlin The electricity unit cost (cost per Kilowatt-Hour) may be high but there is no other technology that can satisfy the requirement to be clean (no CO2) and 100% available upon demand.
Pooter Bilbo
Pooter Bilbo Hace 17 días
There are some significant errors in this video but it gets across an important point: how the true emissions of a product occur over its entire life. In engineering it is called life cycle analysis and is divided into three phases: Production Use Disposal To get a full picture of the emissions of a product we have to consider all phases.. not just the use phase
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 3 días
@oerthling Many good points. Thank you.
oerthling
oerthling Hace 4 días
That is correct. And not at all new. This has been known and calculated for years. Also this graph is obviously wrong. It plots a line based on CO2 content for kw over time as linear. But the clean energy component is rising in developed countries, thus the CO2 per kw is less every year, thus it is a downward curve over the lifetime of the vehicle, not a straight line. Those lifetime calculations have been done and EVs are already winning after a few years - with current tech. In addition, how does he think we get to that future improved battery? By massive investment and R&D and iterating on production processes. The current tech and increasing adoption is the exact way we get to even better batteries and more flexible/cheaper/less problematic materials. Cobalt use per battery unit is already lower than it used to be a decade ago. We can't stop doing that and expecting that improved batteries and production processes magically spring from nowhere in a couple of decades. Battery production and capacity has massively improved over the kast 2 decades *because* they got used in increasing numbers. And hybrids were an interim solution with no future. One advantage of EVs over ICE cars is that they have less parts that need production, maintenance and replacement. With hybrids you need both techs - that is worse than either when it comes to maintenance and repair. That age is already over.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 16 días
@Pooter Bilbo So it's a valuable lesson & we're ignoring the fact that it just happens to be gotten across by lying about it & completely distorting the relationship between...well everything & everything else?
corrion1
corrion1 Hace 24 días
If they really cared about the environment they would legislate a minimum of at least 10years durability on all consumer products
fate testarossa
fate testarossa Hace 3 días
INDEED
ChargersFanSD
ChargersFanSD Hace un día
A bus company I work at recently bought a few electric buses in a push to eventually convert our entire fleet to electric. They were brainwashed by all the circulating EV propaganda. We just found out the true range on these buses was about 130 miles, not nearly enough to run these vehicles in full service. Pretty depressing realizing you just wasn't about 4 million to "go green."
Erth Mann
Erth Mann Hace 29 días
Our energy source will always be chosen by politicians instead of engineers. This will always result in a very few people seeing large benefit while most others pay the price. Don't think so? Research corn produced ethanol, the massive energy it takes to produce, its required use, and the people that benefit from this.
Eric G
Eric G Hace 2 meses
Please do an expanded version of this talking about the batteries, what it take to produce them, there life span, and what happens to them when they have reached the end of their efficient life span.
W T
W T Hace 24 días
@Dean Murray nor the vast amount of earth dug up to harvest rare earth minerals nir the devestation mining has caused the world over. In BC, Canada, companies have left 1800 abandoned mines yet to be cleaned up or reclaimed. Imagine what the, same abandonment looks like in 2nd and 3rd world countries.
mk4th
mk4th Hace 24 días
I had a hard stop, when he claimed that CO2 from a horse is cyclic, but from a car or power plant it isn't. It is the same CO2... The horse provides more greenhouse gases than plain CO2
W T
W T Hace 24 días
@Glenn Cordova Again, so we are told, but there is no actual battery recycling facility operating yet and industry estimates are as low as 5% recyclable to Tesla stating 92% recyclable. Right now, batteries are being stored and to recycle one costs $6750 says Tesla. The concerning issue is that far more batteries are nearing a life end and stored or discarded than actuall being recycled now. Storing is the current solution but Lithium batteries are toxic if they leak and are extremely flammable! Like most things human designed, the race to earn profit was the focus, not designing the end of life strategy!
David Seaton
David Seaton Hace 29 días
@pedraw I never said batteries would ever be fully green but if the product is improved in some way so that they last for longer it would make the product greener. Do you not agree? I think you miss understood my previous reply with regard to warranties.
pedraw
pedraw Hace 29 días
@David Seaton I don't think a warranty makes a product "green". it just makes it replaceable with another product just like it.
Danny Thompson
Danny Thompson Hace 17 días
I would push the button. Some of the key information in this two-year old talk has been discredited in terms of lifecycle emissions. The talk about CO2 does not also take into account that burning pretty much anything in an ICE will continue to emit NoX at the point of use, a toxic emission that is becoming better understood for its devastating health penalty. Graham Conway talks about decades ahead, yet Climatology strongly states that we do not have decades to play about with. Any wiggle room we had back then has been used up by the Oil industry's decades-long campaign of disinformation, slowing down the change processes that should have commenced long ago. Pass me that damned button, now.
Danny Thompson
Danny Thompson Hace 17 días
@Sixgunner dot org Yes. But not pressing it 30 years ago has ensured that we get exactly that. And we have no control of what is now going to happen.
Sixgunner dot org
Sixgunner dot org Hace 17 días
Pressing that button would result in worldwide chaos.
Jim Vonn
Jim Vonn Hace 22 días
Hey Jason; big companies used to like to make cars that last a long time; I had a 1971 Porsche 911T with 1 million + miles I gave to my nephew; finally needs a rebuild; I still have a 1961 Volvo P1800 and Opel Gt all are over 50 years old. People ought to want to have solid vehicles that last; and you could still ride share and save real CO2 rather than talk about it.
Heinous Anus
Heinous Anus Hace 19 días
There's a corporate capitalism prob. Veritasium "Why We Can't Have Nice Things".
Stephen Poe
Stephen Poe Hace 3 días
This is interesting ! And something I have believed for years ! Also the elimination of Forrest through out the World adds to Co2 levels ! He didn't mention that.
Sloreo
Sloreo Hace un mes
As a Corvette owner, I am glad to learn it is as eco friendly as a horse.
Devil's Offspring
Devil's Offspring Hace 12 días
@tenfeetup Yes it is, CO2 is CO2 and plants will use that portion of a car's exhaust. The won't use unburned HC or nitrogen oxides, though.
tenfeetup
tenfeetup Hace 12 días
It is far LESS eco friendly than a horse because the CO2 coming out of your Corvette is not in a renewable cycle with plants the way that a horse is. Did you not listen to the full Ted Talk??✌️
Devil's Offspring
Devil's Offspring Hace 12 días
@dubious distinction About what exactly?
dubious distinction
dubious distinction Hace 12 días
@Devil's Offspring u are absolutely certifiably mad
Lucian Photography
Lucian Photography Hace 15 días
@Miguel Rosario British car engines are in general smaller CC than the USA average car engine. British cars have for many, many years been getting 40-50 MPG as an average with many getting much more. Not so in the USA. That in itself is a sad state of affairs. They have the capacity to make the ICE more efficient in the USA but they are not doing it, for some reason. Maybe it's because the oil companies are in certain pockets, who knows. If they did choose to improve the efficiency of the USA ICE then everything would improve and all these numbers would again change, for the better.
Thomas Safford
Thomas Safford Hace un mes
I'm in the renewable energy field and even that needs to be looked at. During construction and operation of a wind or solar farm, thousands of gallons of diesel are burned every day, not to mention the environmental impacts on tree clearing on a large scale. Plus the life cycle of wind turbines is usually 20-30 years and large components arrive on ships (which burn 2000 gal of heavy diesel per hour) and major components like the blades end up in landfills when the site is repowered as they are not recyclable. Nuclear is the best thing we have so far.
trung nguyen
trung nguyen Hace 5 días
On clear treeing: this is America have you seen our cities? You want trees move to Europe. On fossil fuels debate end the fossil due subsidies and watch diesel usage go way down. Yes green gets subsidies 20% of all energy subsidies goes to green. 70% goes to oil.
Gary Whiddon
Gary Whiddon Hace un mes
@Dennis Feeney Mass transit in the vast majority of the country - where people commute?
ebert
ebert Hace un mes
@1983jakesan one spin of wind turbine is enough to power a home for a day ( the better ones now a dayes 2homes
Game How You Like
Game How You Like Hace un mes
@Gavin BIDDISCOMBE I've never seen someone more wrong about nuclear energy. Go look up hiw modern nuclear power generation actually works and unless you're just being a crazy contrarian you'll see how incredibly efficient, safe and clean it actually is. It is the best solution with the technology we possess at this time.
David Ladd
David Ladd Hace 22 días
One more thing. Conventional vehicles require an oil change every 3-6000 miles. Very few consumers are willing to accept the use of recycle oil for that. That ought to be factored in, but I don’t have the tools to do the analysis. Would like to see it, though.
Steve Garlock
Steve Garlock Hace 20 días
Vehicle oil is 100% recycled. Check
Ivan Delgado
Ivan Delgado Hace 21 un día
They have the ability to create oil less engines ( not completely oil less but one that uses super thin oil that lasts for many months)but they don't want to because car oil is a multi billion industry
Colin Wessels
Colin Wessels Hace 9 días
1) Fuel price. 2) Hydro electricity. 3) Newer batteries. 4) POLLUTION.
1WhoConquers
1WhoConquers Hace 24 días
Two other considerations come to mind... 1) Here in the USA, the power grid already struggles when everyone wants to turn on their air conditioners at the same time during a heat wave. Can you imagine the mess when _everyone_ is charging their electric cars? 2) What about junked cars? How much worse for the environment, and how much more of a safe disposal issue will it be, when all those electric cars with ginormous batteries owned by _everyone_ start going to the scrap heap?
chubstheclown
chubstheclown Hace 20 días
@Kurses and Karma Yes... during the day (Florida). When most EVs aren't charging. The ones that do charge during the day can take their power from the electricity that would have otherwise been used to refine and deliver gasoline. Again... check with your utility and ask what the demand is during the day vs during the night. We can sit here and imagine all sorts of scenarios, but the only one that matters is what actually happens.
Kurses and Karma
Kurses and Karma Hace 20 días
@chubstheclown But then calculate the need for heat in the N.E. when it's winter and the furnaces and heat pumps pulling power from the grid. During the day, swimming pool pumps are running daily in FL, regardless whether its cold or hot.
chubstheclown
chubstheclown Hace 20 días
@Kurses and Karma That is true for you and some others, but "all over the USA" is a bit of a stretch. And even in areas where this is needed, the draw from AC is much lower at night than it is while the sun is beating down. Of course, this question can only be answered by contacting your utility and asking them what the demand is during the day vs during the night.
Kurses and Karma
Kurses and Karma Hace 20 días
@chubstheclown I live in the Southern U.S. We have to run our A/C at night. Summer is summer and the A/C will be run all over the U.S., regardless.
bruce halleran
bruce halleran Hace 21 un día
@Jewell Johnson but a fair majority of us charge at home starting around the time Rush hour is tapering off.
Mauricio Medina
Mauricio Medina Hace 16 días
Great talk and info. It's important to keep in mind that we (the global community) are currently spending millions on battery tech research. Every day we get closer to a better for the environment and cheaper to produce battery.
Karl Günter Wünsch
@ForbiddTV Wrong, battery technology has progressed immensely. Lithium ion batteries have nothing in common except the name battery with those lead acid batteries. Just to compare, a 100 Ah starter battery has 1,2 kWh of charge, contains around 30kg of lead which is rarer than lithium in the earths crust and overall weight is 45kg. So let's scale that to a typical EV battery at 70 kWh, that's 58 times the energy on 400-500 kg of overall weight of which 11.2 kg is lithium. the lead battery would weigh 2.6 tonnes, contain 1740kg of lead and would have 3 times the volume... A lithium battery could hold 9 times the charge but it's chemistry is too volatile for the use in a car. A current EV battery holds only that fraction because the chemistry buys us safety from dangers like internal short circuits - which is why current EV are 44 times less likely to catch fire. Just that every EV on fire makes it into international news, if the same happened with ICE cars then there would be globally distributed news from the US every 3.5 minutes (which is the rate that somewhere in the US statistically an ICE car starts to burn in an unintended way...
ForbiddTV
ForbiddTV Hace 15 días
You have been saying that for decades, and yet we aren't much farther than the 100+ year old lead acid battery. You must be the same guy that has been telling me for all my 60 years that nuclear fusion is just around the corner.
Frenchie Aurora
Frenchie Aurora Hace un mes
A coal plant is roughly 60% more efficient than a vehicle at turning the raw material into useable energy. He is skewing the numbers. A coal plant, in all it's massive size, is of course more efficient at creating energy than every little car on the road. Yes, it is less negative on the environment to charge vehicles on the grid than it is to use gasoline. A tad disingenuous, this one. He also included the emissions for creating the electric vehicle and supply it with energy without including the emissions for drilling for oil and transporting and refining all of that too. This is one of the worst TedTalks I have ever seen. Usually they are great and make you think, this one, I don't believe the "orator" even put real thought into it.
Love of the game
Love of the game Hace un mes
The future is eclectic. Agreed 100% We all have different driving needs, sometimes one type of shoe just doesn't fit for everything.
tim dryden
tim dryden Hace 4 días
@J4Zonian 1/2 way through, will require multiple reads, quite interesting, and learning a lot. Thanks!
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 4 días
@tim dryden "Correcting Anti-Renewable Energy Propaganda" cleantechnica 2/9/2020
Slayer8957
Slayer8957 Hace 16 días
@J4Zonian ICE cars will never be gone. Even when the last lithium deposit is mined out, ICE cars will still be running all over the world.
tim dryden
tim dryden Hace 17 días
@J4Zonian No time soon. Reuters>"Less than 1% of the 250 million cars, SUVs and light-duty trucks on the road in the United States are electric". ---AND are over stressing the grid, as people are being asked to not charge their ev's during peak demand.
SanVic
SanVic Hace un mes
Graham Conway works for the Southwest Research Institute, which was founded by oil businessman Tom Slick.
Merrill Fratkin
Merrill Fratkin Hace 27 días
Definitely! These arguments always have one fundamental flaw … they leave out the entirety of what it takes to produce oil. If you’re going to “expand” the box around electric vehicles, you’ll also need to around ICE vehicles and include the defense budgets to secure the oil fields, transportation costs, refinement costs, environmental disaster costs, etc.
Karl Günter Wünsch
@Robert White An EV does not need any rare earth elements - contrary to the ICE which couldn't exist without...
MC
MC Hace 21 un día
He also works for Automotive Division at Southwest Research Institute; they work on engines a LOT. So, the more he can convince people to use ICE or hybrids, the more money they make. His graph also shows a few bad things. For EV's he uses the least efficient ones. For the ICE, he uses the most efficient ones, and for the hybrids he also uses the most efficient ones. None are the "average" as he said. The conventional would be MUCH higher in emissions if he used the average and the electric would be lower. I wouldn't trust an actor, especially when the description also says; "NOTE FROM TED: This talk only reflects the speaker's personal views and interpretation. Several claims in this talk lack scientific support. We've flagged this talk because it falls outside the content guidelines TED gives TEDx organizers. "
St-Ex
St-Ex Hace 26 días
@Robert White sorry, but modern battery packs have a life expectancy much longer than any combustion engine! Early ones had their problems, but that is a thing of the past!
Robert White
Robert White Hace 26 días
Pretty sure that you could replace oil fields with the rare earth mines that would be needed, which would have their own ecological problems, bottom line you would still need all those for electric cars. Also battery packs do not have a great Lifespan compared to combustion,major problem which would seem to increase ev overall co2
St-Ex
St-Ex Hace 27 días
Excellent remark!
Jeff Riley
Jeff Riley Hace un mes
A good analysis, but surprisingly he missed the amount of CO2 emitted in mining rare earth elements for solar panels and wind turbines, not to mention they contain massive amounts of processed petroleum products we often refer to as plastics.
Stephen Lee
Stephen Lee Hace 20 días
@Kurses and Karma sure, but we need to switch over to a renewable economy quickly first.
Kurses and Karma
Kurses and Karma Hace 20 días
@Stephen Lee True. We must not forget the mining and pollution we emit when extracting and excavating for these minerals as well.
Stephen Lee
Stephen Lee Hace 20 días
@Kurses and Karma it's legitimate to be concerned about the end of life activities of solar and batteries. Currently, yes, a lot of them are being shoved into a landfill because it's cheaper to do it that way.. when has the human race ever done the right thing when it costed more /s? But there are companies out there looking at the projected growth of the amount of EV waste and looking to make a buck by recycling them. Let's not forget. There are a lot of variable minerals and metals involved in the construction of a solar panel such as the silicon and silver elements. Those are still worth a lot of money by mass/weight. It's just a matter of getting enough infrastructure set up so that you can process these solar panels at scale and make a profit. Same idea with the batteries.
Kurses and Karma
Kurses and Karma Hace 20 días
@Stephen Lee and @Gord Cross, How can you recycle battery cells from EV's and solar panels? From my novice understanding, all rechargeable batteries will max out. They too will have a shelf life. Can anyone chime in here and tell me how toxic are they to dispose of in a landfill? If not in a landfill, then where is the final resting place? So now we'll have solar panels & their batteries, and EV batteries to dispose of. It appears to me that no one is talking about the mass amounts of waste from this sector that is going to have to be addressed in the future. I'm not here to argue, just looking to learn.
D RAIDER
D RAIDER Hace 26 días
Would increased co2 result in greater plant health? When comparing the horse to the automobile, the cycle has been completed by plants consuming co2. What happened to the plants when looking at the cycle of the EV or Internal combustion vehicle?
Dronez
Dronez Hace 23 días
No, generally, existing plants wont dynamically adapt to an increase in CO2 and begin to flourish, (some have been genetically modified to absorb more CO2 than it naturally would otherwise, but would have zero impact on this scale, for plants, its a slow evolution for them to adapt to their atmosphere.............
Gary Jones
Gary Jones Hace 26 días
Exactly ... sleight of hand there. Let's be honest.
MotorDetroit
MotorDetroit Hace un mes
References please. Especially for the CO2 requirements for vehicle and Battery Pack construction.
Andrew Jensen
Andrew Jensen Hace 16 días
​@Si Milner what exactly is your point? The energy it takes to create a single solar panel is paid back by the panel in the first 1 to 4 years of its own power generation. Most solar panels last at least 25 years, so that's 21 to 24 years of additional power generation that each panel gives back, which, I'm gonna wager, also pays many times over for the energy required to mine the raw materials for creating solar cells. And this all assumes that the mining and manufacturing equipment for making panels is not already powered by renewable energy, which we can expect to be the case in the future. With oil there is zero return of the CO2 that's emitted to drill, refine, and ship it. And then there's oil spills that have devastating consequences to ecosystems and the environment -- this also needs to be factored into the equation. As for the depreciation of manufacturing and mining equipment -- that's not a unique problem with solar; you can ask the same question about most industries. What happens when the machinery used to drill and refine oil degrades? What about the depreciation of the millions of oil shipping trucks? Gas pumps and gas stations?
Benjamin Morton
Benjamin Morton Hace 16 días
@Si Milner Luckily we have oil and coal, which require no mining or manufacture, and fossil fuel fired power plants which require no maintenance, and never degrade.
Si Milner
Si Milner Hace 20 días
and then there's the total energy output required to mine, manufacture and maintain solar and wind farms.. not to mention what happens to these sources when they all degrade..
Andrew Jensen
Andrew Jensen Hace 21 un día
@MC yes! And the environmental damage of oil spills.
MC
MC Hace 21 un día
But before references he needs to talk about the CO2 created of drilling oil, transporting it, refining it, and transporting it again.
karl patterson
karl patterson Hace 26 días
Great discussion of this issue. I have been saying for years that hybrid is the solution for now and the foreseeable future, although I could never explain it this well. Thanks.
Karl Günter Wünsch
@Timothy Keith Define fast charging. In the scientific community fast charging starts off at 6C, which is the charging rate at which the lifecycles of new batteries is tested in the laboratory. A 100kWh battery that charges at 6C would require a 600kW fast charger (these are being defined for lorries at the moment, but their batteries are bigger still, so the 600kW charging speed would equate to about 2-3C)... An active battery management like in current EV can prevent charging degradation for the most part. What really is detrimental is letting the battery drain fully or have it rest at 100% for extended periods of time...
Timothy Keith
Timothy Keith Hace 19 días
@Andrew Currin I agree, fast charging that does not degrade the battery is sufficient - but not possible in 2022
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 25 días
@karl patterson You couldn't explain it because there was no explanation then & there's none now. The assertions in the video are false, the assumptions are wrong, & the reasoning is faulty. Hybrids perpetuate fossil fuel use, create more inevitably-stranded assets, pile more carbon into the air, take the focus off the real solutions. The Brits canceled their hybrid subsidy after a study found people mostly weren't recharging them, just using them as ICEVs. BEVs are crucial, but by far the most important transit solutions are staying put, walking, bicycling, & public transit including a state of the art national/international high speed rail network to replace flying & long-distance driving, well-anchored in regional & local transit systems.
Andrew Currin
Andrew Currin Hace 25 días
personally im still waiting for a good explanation, who need to drive 400 miles on a charge, lol
Jason Pyles
Jason Pyles Hace 25 días
Need whole lot more studies on hydragene fuel cells to power all engines
Sean Curtin
Sean Curtin Hace un mes
Why can the future not be magnetic? There are forces not properly explored which could be an option. The trouble with ALL electric isn't the cars themselves as such. It's the fact we currently don't have the power grid setup anywhere on the planet to support them. Please don't forget to note that the pollution caused by all petrol and fossil fuel vehicles in the world, is less than 4%. Look at the major contributors and look at reducing and fixing those areas before focusing as always with an onus on the end user. You got it, not Ionly do we require more power stations we need stations that reduce emissions for the long haul
Mister Mister
Mister Mister Hace un mes
In 2004, my company asked me if I wanted to work from home and I said yes. Telecommuters work longer hours, have great quality and goof off less. That is being green. I have saved over 30,000 in fuel.
tim dryden
tim dryden Hace 17 días
You may make a living pecking on a keypad, and if so my hat's off to ya, but that doesn't make it "work"
clovala
clovala Hace 28 días
@Fares Hajjar are you in management? My guess is you are. Numerous studies out say just the opposite.
Jay Bee
Jay Bee Hace un mes
yup. I keep telling my customers the same thing- but the conversation goes something like this: "my toilet is clogged- can you come out & fix it." (me) well, do you have a ridgid power snake? I can tell you how to UNCLOG it over the phone. the call will only cost you $1 a minute. "...... click... DIALTONE".
Friend Help
Friend Help Hace un mes
You’re welcome
Kevin Bartram
Kevin Bartram Hace un mes
I repair trucks for a living. I think my neighbors would have some thing to say if I worked from home in this small avenue.
James Cornish
James Cornish Hace 29 días
A couple of things that were left out of your calculations… using your gasoline engine cycle, the plants are still involved in that calculation, as it was with the horse analogy. The difference is, the oxygen is used by human and other animals on the planet. Currently CO2 is about 400-600 parts per million in the atmosphere and the idea level for plants would be 800 ppm. Thousands of years ago, it dropped to about 180 ppm and plants would all die off at about 150 ppm. So having lower CO2 levels isn’t always as good as climate change proponents would like us to believe. Also, with higher CO2 levels, plants continue to thrive, using more CO2, which produces more O2. Also, higher global temperatures on average also means more places will have an easier time growing crops for food where previously difficult. The second way electric batteries impact on the planet is the amount of mining required to get all the minerals from the ground to make these batteries. As well, the recycling of the batteries is not as good as a typical gasoline car battery (most of common batteries are recyclable where as lithium ion batteries are very costly and require a lot of energy to recycle).
Cevdet Gz
Cevdet Gz Hace 29 días
The problem is the earth isn't a plant planet anymore it used to be in the beginning but unfortunately is populated be humans now. And humans don't like the climate change and it's devastating effects like we are experiencing more and more often.
streetwise10000
streetwise10000 Hace 28 días
On a personal level this has always been the issue .
needforfieros
needforfieros Hace un mes
so plants can tell the difference between CO2 from a horse and CO2 from a Corvette? He is right but has flaws as well. The whole package needs to be considered. He also missed the portion that the battery does not last much more than 100,000 miles. I would like to see the analysis of the CO2 generated in creating a wind generator vs the energy produced. The amount of aluminum, steel and graphite is amazing. also the loss of land vs the loss of plants to generate O2 is a problem. the Blades on the wind generators only last a short time but the damage to the land is permanent.
Ahole Crap
Ahole Crap Hace 2 días
Nice presentation it was pretty informative
Danky-_-Stanky
Danky-_-Stanky Hace 2 meses
I feel like oil changes should also be calculated into a gas vehicles emissions plus transporting fuel to gas stations, building semis and tankers to transport said fuel as well as ships 🚢 that transport oil, all the drilling equipment for the extraction of oil. Plus producing the vast amount of different parts internal combustion engines need and the transportation of those parts. Plus mining, transporting, producing, shipping, digging and maintaining pipelines for transporting fuels and oils across vast distances needs to be calculated. I can just keep going on and on. All aspects of electric vehicle production needs to be calculated as well and I can say for sure I’d be very interested in seeing properly researched and calculated results.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 15 días
@Sportster06 Because the evidence proves them wrong? No, wait, that couldn't be it... surely they're not being ........ dishonest!
Steve Garlock
Steve Garlock Hace 20 días
Yes, there is a lot of information left out. All of the petro options also apply to e vehicles as well. Mining copper, mining lithium, mining so many other rare earth materials. The end result should be viewed closely. The petro goes to the recycler and the ecar goes to the hazardous waste site to be stored for eternity. Sadly no clear silver lining to be found yet.
Sportster06
Sportster06 Hace 27 días
@Jeff Hunt do your own research. Why do deniers always need to ask for evidence when they can actually find the truth themselves.
Jeff Hunt
Jeff Hunt Hace 28 días
@Sportster06 the problem is the sun doesn't stay out 24/7/365. That means you're still going to need storage, which means batteries. Tell me, just how enviromentaly freindly are batteries?
Sportster06
Sportster06 Hace 28 días
@Jeff Hunt ever heard of a company called Rio Tinto? How about Fortescue Metals or BHP? Big miners with the biggest mines running the biggest equipment. All moving ahead with their own solar arrays to transition or heavily reduce the massive CO2 footprints they have to mine ore. Haul Packs, shovels and trains running on Electricity. The mines are in Western Australia and guess what, the sun is vicious, relentless and powerful. Indonesia and Japan want to run cables from the top of Australia to pump the renewable energy over for themselves. It’s all happening while people sit around and still try to argue it won’t work or it can’t be done. It does work and it’s happening.
Filemon Kevin Samson
Filemon Kevin Samson Hace 23 días
He omits consideration of a major factor in the equation to reach his conclusion about hybrid vehicles - REPAIR COSTS. With higher technology dependant electric vehicles there are electronic components that need updates. With internal combustion engines there are mechanical parts that wear out and need replacement. A hybrid vehicle has BOTH, so it seems there are twice as many opportunities for system component failures. There may be even more failure links in the combustion/electric integration system (getting them both to work seamlessly together). For the average person, minimizing personal vehicle repair costs is a major consideration in the vehicle purchase calculation.
Slayer8957
Slayer8957 Hace 16 días
This is just flat out wrong. There is no additional failure links in hybrid. In fact, the worst part about BEVs is having 1000+ lbs of battery. Smaller batteries are better and easier to replace on a cellular level. You can drastically reduce the necessary batteries with an accompanying ICE in the car. Not to mention the lithium fires will become less likely to occur and less explosive the smaller the batteries you use. If anything, you can even continue to use nickel batteries, and not need to starve the poor of water in Argentina, Bolivia, and Chile just to mine their lithium
Alan Greenberg
Alan Greenberg Hace 21 un día
I drive a hybrid. Since both systems operate at different times there is less wear on each, for example I just changed the small battery after seven years of use which is double the life of a regular battery.
Benergy
Benergy Hace 28 días
Don’t forget to expand that box around fossil fuel vehicles to include downstream refining and fuel transportation, midstream pipelines transit, upstream production, and finally drilling exploration.
Benergy
Benergy Hace 27 días
@Craig Anthony and RJ45 connectors aren’t actually RJ45. They are 8P8C connectors. It’s just too frivolous to debate such a widely used term over such a small and questionable technicality.
Factorized
Factorized Hace 27 días
@Craig Anthony sorry but couldn’t resist : fuel is fossil by essence :) (Yes fuel is transformed, so not fossil anymore, if this is what you meant)
Matthew Hardin
Matthew Hardin Hace 28 días
@Benergy that’s why in the ME there is so much oil as well.
Benergy
Benergy Hace 28 días
@Craig Anthony I’ve personally examined microscopic fossils while drilling into formations. It’s used to determine the epoch through stratigraphic super-positioning. Any remains of plant or animal, including their carbohydrates that formed kerogen that was later cracked into crude oil and gas are still fossils. Most of it came from algae in warm anoxic oceans.
Craig Anthony
Craig Anthony Hace 28 días
There’s no such thing as “fossil fuel.” Peace. Out.
garfgo
garfgo Hace 27 días
I think most people understand that EVs are not zero pollution. That little zero emission insignia is a marketing gimmick. I sometimes think people expect something "new" to be perfect or else it is worse than something else, especially something they are used to. In this talk he used global electricity production which is useful as a whole, but does not reflect what is going on in many countries. In the US for example, coal is used to generate about 20% of the electricity, natural gas about 40%, natural gas contributes half as much co2 as coal for the same electricity generation, and that's not counting the release of co2 during extraction, where once again coal produces much more simply by the nature of how it is mined. Here is where it gets interesting, even gasoline is cleaner than coal, so how can an EV powered by coal be cleaner than a ICE car, the answer is that an ICE car is only about 20% efficient at converting that gasoline into energy where as a coal power plant is double that efficiency in turning coal into electricity. Even so coal is not an ideal source of energy compared to other sources other than the fact that it is very abundant which is no small thing. So moving away from coal changes the curve dramatically even if other fossil fuels are used to create electricity. Unfortunately, until China, which uses half of all the coal worldwide, goes to other sources of electricity production it may be difficult to make much of a dent in global co2 emissions. I am not an engineer or scientist, this is just something I think about as I read, so I welcome any corrections in my train of thought.
𝕱𝖗𝖊𝖊𝖉𝖔𝖒 1776 🇺🇸
I find it kind've scary that most people did'nt and still do not have enough common sense to look at the process of how electric vehicles are made and if the outcome is worth the process..... That kind've thinking is simply independent thinking
David Rumsey
David Rumsey Hace 2 meses
I absolutely agree that the energy / pollution / CO2 equation for electric vehicles has to include the source of the energy that powers the vehicle. What I didn't hear you say is that the same should be done for fuel burning vehicles. The petrol (gasoline) or diesel fuel you put into your car didn't magically appear in the tanks of the gas station. The energy costs, pollution and emissions of oil exploration, oil well construction, pipeline construction, pumping, shipping, refining, road transport etc all have to be added to the emissions "produced" by your Internal Combustion car, in the same way you ask that the emissions from power stations should be added to the electric vehicles' emissions. Also, if you want to point out (correctly) that in many parts of the world, electricity comes from burning fossil fuels, then you also have to consider that there is a lot of electricity inherent in each gallon of gasoline or diesel. Research the electricity consumption of oil refineries (absolutely huge), realise that liquid fuels are often pumped with electrically powered pumps etc. One university study concluded that the amount of electricity inherent in a gallon of gasoline would drive an electric car at least half the distance that the liquid fuel would drive an internal combustion car. So yes, look at the whole picture for electric vehicles, but also look at the whole picture for internal combustion cars, hydrogen cars and all alternatives. I drive (and love) an electric car, but I have solar panels and live in New Zealand where over 80% of our electricity comes from renewable resources, especially at night when the vast majority of electric cars are charged.
Alessandro Fadini
Alessandro Fadini Hace 29 días
Correct! This is why one should not watch TED talks.
Gary Whiddon
Gary Whiddon Hace un mes
@dionysusnow Or wars for the materials to make those expensive batteries.
Gary Whiddon
Gary Whiddon Hace un mes
@William Rees You mean studies written by EV industry reps?
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace un mes
@dionysusnow More than $7 trillion since 2000, (everything considered, more like 10+) more than enough to upgrade the grid & replace all the fossil fuels the US uses with efficiency, wiser lives, & clean safe fast cheap reliable renewable energy, build a national state of the art high speed rail network hooked into local & regional transit systems, & do lots more of what's needed to prevent catastrophe.
J.J. Weinberg
J.J. Weinberg Hace un mes
It isn't a clever shift of responsibility from the auto manufacturer. It's a clear way to solve a problem. It's funny that he dives deep into the analysis on all levels but doesn't trace the reality that shifting away from coal and oil are easier to do top down than 1 BILLION cars from the bottom up. It's funny that the battery has been demonized without perspective of how ALL TECHNOLOGY progresses. By the same logic, all of the people who respond to this on their cell phones wouldn't be able to because computers have to be the size of a room and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars for a single mainframe. The battery wasn't allowed to evolve due to being stamped down by fossil fuel and auto interests. It has yet to hit a stride because of being craftly deincentivized. The logic is flawed and a direct result of the indoctrination of industries that have had a stranglehold on affairs GLOBALLY.
claude grayson
claude grayson Hace un mes
Has anyone done a comparison of all fossil fueld vehicles to show which is the cleanest.other than hybrids? Maybe its time to put lead back in petrl as it was always found close to the tarmac and was better for the enviro than the junk they replaced it with.
Jack Michael Peter
Jack Michael Peter Hace un mes
Very compelling argument. The real solution is for a considerable amount of people to not own cars anymore rather than replacing their old car with a new one. Redesign city public transport. Individuals rethink their work / accomodation arrangement. Companies redesign their operations to not involve small vehicle use.
DRS Prof
DRS Prof Hace un mes
agree totally. Just go by push bike or just find accommodation close to work or study. It will be much more relaxed as well.
Highland Communications
Great presentation and an excellent factual look at electric vehicles. However, what about the energy spent manufacturing windmills and solar panels? Even with renewable energy, it will never be zero emissions. And if you rely on wind and solar to generate power to charge your car, I hope the nurse, doctors, and everyone else working night shift can get to work and back on a single charge.
Highland Communications
@winston adair hybrid...it's all a wash. They still have to extract fossil fuels to make all the plastics, heat and form the metals. I've driven a hybrid and they're not as efficient as people make them seem
winston adair
winston adair Hace 24 días
Go the hybred way
Michael White
Michael White Hace un mes
Didn't see any consideration of the C02 cost of retrieving, refining and transporting the fuel for normal ICE vehicles? Having worked in the marine Oil industry, I can tell you that's a fair amount to take into consideration. There is also the consideration of generating electricity on large scale vs small scale usage of fuel. I live and work in Norway, where all electric power is generated from hydro electric sources (so that flattens out the graph for electric cars quite drastically, cutting down the CO2 crossover point with ICE cars to somewhere between 2 to 4 years of usage) - which I know is a luxury situation (Norway has over half of Europe's hydro capacity I believe) The gas and oil produced in this country is mainly exported to other countries for them to burn ;-), with the exception of the fuel refined for all forms of transport (road vehicles, air transport and shipping) - although a lot of money and energy has recently been put into coming up with a gas power plant with CO2 scrubbers. My personal opinion is that the electric motor is the way to go for small vehicles, but batteries are maybe not the power source we should be using. Hydrogen is the fuel that should be the focus, but unfortunately the current ways of utilising it are expensive to manufacture, require elaborate storage solutions and quantities of rare metals in the fuel cells (which hinders mass production). Battery technology is currently advancing at a healthy rate, so I don't see hydrogen tech attracting the necessary big bucks (until a 'eureka' breakthrough happens in any case). Most renewable sources of energy that are being invested in are also intermittent sources (solar, wind) which will only be effective when combined with an energy storage solution (which in most cases is looking like battery storage at the moment). I personally don't understand why more money isn't being put into geothermal and infra red energy harvesting, as these both have the potential to provide a constant stream of energy 24/7
adam rushing
adam rushing Hace 24 días
@Tranquil thoughts There are two ways to factor this. It can either be a 400 mile battery or he could have factored in charging it 3.2 times. He chose the former. Either way, any effort to compare apples to apples would have to have some sort of comparison there. Also, as he stated, we want vehicles with more miles than that. I live in Remote Alaska...if I were to every even THINK of the possibility of an electric car, it would have to have a MUCH greater range than 125 miles. I'd assume that what the reason he went with the 400 mile battery - because to get EVs to become mainstream, that would be a requirement.
adam rushing
adam rushing Hace 24 días
@J B That would be an exhaustive study! I don't think it would be possible. Especially when you factor everything that Oil, and its byproducts, are in. Oil is in everything from the roads you drive on, to the clothes you wear, to the computer you use, to the food you eat and the medicines you take. It is literally everywhere. Not to mention, the only pockets deep enough to fund such a survey probably wouldn't want the full/true answers anyway...they like to get just enough info that they can skew it their way, yet leave enough out that people like us are always saying "yea but....".
Kevin Reeve
Kevin Reeve Hace 24 días
Applaud Norway for their 90% electricity from HydroPower. Norway has 5.4 million people. US is third largest producer of hydropower in the World. Current expansion at least in USA will need to come from more efficient hydro generators as environmental groups will pretty much shut down any new ideas for dams to generate more. In fact they are trying to take one offline on the Colorado.
Brent
Brent Hace 24 días
You do know we still need the other parts of crude oil for the plastic and chemical industry. Drilling for crude will continue as it is the most valuable resource on the planet regardless if we use it for fuel or not.
Carl Bennett
Carl Bennett Hace 26 días
Appreciate you sharing your wealth of knowledge on the subject.
Mike Truitt
Mike Truitt Hace un mes
One point on his calculations - Tesla is giving an 8 year / 120K mile battery warranty on its new autos. One could assume that the ~ $20K replacement that is based on "typical" usage is the calculated point of replacement. Having said that any L-ION Battery based product would at least create actual cost of ownership of say 33% percent more CO2 tonnage based on the average salvage life given of 180K Miles. All this simply to store energy created from another source. This is not critique but furthers his point. The reality is that society has a mindset of individual transport at will. We go where we want when we want. I suggest that what would have the greatest sustainability is mass transit or maybe a distributed transit system, at least with the technology of today.
johnnylance
johnnylance Hace 10 días
Anyone who has thought about this subject realizes that we need better batteries, and electricity generated by the sun (etc.), to make electric vehicles work. He has told us nothing new. We need to redirect fossil fuel industry subsides (and more) into doing the necessary development... new generation batteries, new solar plants and new electric vehicles can be produced concurrently. We don't have to wait. We do have to have the will...
George n1naz
George n1naz Hace un mes
One other thing, how much fuel and CO2 output does it take to transport the fuel from the oil fields to the gas pump? Pumping oil out of the ground, transporting it to the refinery..., fuel used by the refinery..., transporting the fuel to the gas station... all emit CO2
Karl Günter Wünsch
@Benergy Once the traditional oil wells run dry the so called unconventional sources will result in significant increase of this factor. Tar sand extraction will yield a factor of about 2.5, arctic deposit exploitation a factor of 3.5... Traditional oil wells will expire within the lifetime of an ICE bought new today...
Benergy
Benergy Hace 27 días
Multiply your CO2 at the tailpipe by 1.25, as a general rule.
Mr. Z.
Mr. Z. Hace un mes
Nuclear + electric vehicles = SUCCESS
Will Goetz
Will Goetz Hace un mes
This always seems like a taboo, but what about investing in nuclear energy? Wind and solar are great, but they require an exponential amount of land conversion to generate the same amount of energy as a nuclear power plant. They also require some rare earth materials (particularly solar) and they don't last as long as other power plants. I know nuclear is scary because of Chernobyl and Fukushima, but I think it's time for us to have serious discussion about this form of energy.
Will Goetz
Will Goetz Hace un mes
@seguefischlin interesting. I have watched a couple other TED talks where the speakers made it seem like nuclear was the clear way to go. One speaker even addressed concerns on waste disposal and was convincing enough to me that it seemed safe and sustainable if handled properly.
seguefischlin
seguefischlin Hace un mes
I used to do massage fulltime. One of my clients was a nuclear engineer for 25 years. I asked him why he got out of the industry. He replied: 'There's no future in nuclear energy.' When asked to elaborate, it seemed that it comes down to the extreme costs around safety and longterm problems of managing such a dangerous medium before during and after. If you look at France, who is mostly run on nuclear, their electricity rates per kWh are some of the highest in Europe. Also, their power plants are aging (some are nearing 50 yrs old) and they haven't even begun to have to deal with decommissioning/upgrading existing plants yet. So, to summarize, France has some of the highest electricity costs currently and haven't even begun to shoulder the real costs yet of nuclear power.
Will Goetz
Will Goetz Hace un mes
@Kevin Johannes I haven't done a ton of research, but from what I have seen/read, nuclear waste isn't really that difficult to safely deal with. And it goes inert after a certain number of years, so it's not something that destroys or pollutes the earth forever and ever. I just think we are simply too afraid of it because of the very few, but catastrophic nonetheless, incidents that have happened AND big oil/coal/natural gas continue to lobby governments to keep themselves in business.
Kevin Johannes
Kevin Johannes Hace un mes
One problem is this discussion we always have when introducing "the solution to our problems": Q: "Do we know if this new product will cause harm to the earth in the future?" A: "No. We will have nuclear waste. It's dangerous and we don't know what to do with it exactly except store it for the next few years." Q: "Do we care?" A: "No, let's go!"
Will Goetz
Will Goetz Hace un mes
@Robert Marmaduke very interesting. I'm not surprised it costs more to build in the US, but that does seem extreme. I'm also curious as to why China would still invest in coal power if they can do nuclear... Especially considering how overcrowded and polluted their cities already are.
Teachers On Fire
Teachers On Fire Hace 27 días
Unless I'm mistaken, this thesis assumes that the production of EVs relies on fossil fuel power grids (ie. coal). What about power grids based on renewable energy, namely hydro?
Adam Knight
Adam Knight Hace 25 días
hydro power has it's own issues. Environmental damage for dams and reservoirs can be very extensive, wrecking water based lands and species. Also, we are drying out so the availability of water is an issues. That's why CA started to look at taking used water from OR & WA at one point. And wind turbines can be environmentally problematic also, decimating bird populations. We need to look a multiple answers for world size issues. Solar power generation in sunny areas, wind power in low bird population areas, as well as fission (and hopefully fusion in the future w/good signs from the tokamak reactor in Oxford) in low population areas may be key.
Heater
Heater Hace un mes
What a crock. A modern EV should be able to run for 400,000 miles and batteries have improved. So I believe they are already a winner in terms of CO2 production over their lifetime and required range. Not only that they don't dump pollutants into our crowded cities like gas and hybrid cars do, that is a huge win. ICE engines have indeed reached the end of development, there is unlikely to be further gains in efficiency or emissions production to be made. Anyway, who cares about all that climate change stuff, that is no fun. But EVs perform better than ICE cars. That is fun. So just say no to hybrids, they have little benefit and only hold up development of EVs whilst dragging their ICE motors around like boat anchors.
Brohan
Brohan Hace 29 días
In 2021, 99% of Arizona's total electricity net generation was provided from 6 sources: natural gas (43%); nuclear power (28%); coal (13%); solar energy (9%); hydroelectric power (5%): and wind (1%
Informed citizen
Informed citizen Hace un mes
Nuclear power is our only realistic means of meeting our energy demands. The amount of acreage needed for wind farms and or solar fields would be massive, think in terms of hundreds of square miles. Hydro electric would help but not just from rivers, we need to harness the currents and tides of the ocean without impacting marine life as well. Hybrid technology is our only hope for the foreseeable future while fully electric vehicles are just a small component.
Trust Me
Trust Me Hace 29 días
I find the most conventional form of transport is teleportation, but I'm from the future. Still uses energy though... controlled fushion particle
Karen Huffman
Karen Huffman Hace 11 días
Every type of energy production has an environmental cost as well. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t pursue renewable energy, but we need to be honest about the environmental and humanitarian costs of mining lithium for batteries, disposing of solar panels, establishing wind farms in migration paths, and so on. Renewable does not always mean green. We will go in the wrong direction sometimes but we must go. I just hope we can strive for equity and wisdom as we attempt to curb climate change and provide for the best possible future.
Kosta Lazarev
Kosta Lazarev Hace un mes
What comes from the tail pipe is not just CO2, many other toxic gasses, additionally he said not one word on the production of oil, the pollution, the transfer by oil rigs and massive boats, trucks etc. Like petrol and diesel fuel just appear magically in gas stations.
John Smith
John Smith Hace 22 días
Thank you very much for listening. Please also give an applause to my sponsor Big Oil & Gas🤣 References please...
Paul Fry
Paul Fry Hace un mes
Windmills and solar panels also need to be manufactured and maintained, and the manufacturing and maintenance processes generate carbon dioxide. I continue to believe that all the major innovations will be on the demand side of the equation... UNLESS we choose nuclear which has been demonized as relentlessly as fossil fuels.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace un mes
@Tony Stanley Comfort is just comfort;. I made it completely clear what I was talking about by using 3 related words for it; you're using the equivocation fallacy, ambiguity that creates confusion & doubt. It's a common tactic globally wealthy people use to relieve themselves of guilt over their narcissistic indulgence & outlandish consumption & destruction. I make the point about human impact over & over & over here & elsewhere. But it's not a question of just tweaking a few worst practices; we are massively overwhelming the biosphere & only a radical shift in our relationships will change enough of the impact to survive. That will take recognition that our problems are all caused by psychological conditions, & an intervention by a combination of peaceful direct action, education, & conventional psychotherapy. That will take a long time; we need to buy that time by solving the GHG crisis before civilization collapses. In the 1930s FDR did that for the US, but it was incomplete, & the seeds of the current crisis were sewn by rich white conservatives & the formation of the interwoven psycho-industrial complexes.
Treece Barringer
Treece Barringer Hace un mes
Windmills kill to many eagles
Will WebStar
Will WebStar Hace 2 horas
Talk about the efficiency loss when you burn fuel to create electrical energy and then take high voltage AC to low voltage DC to charge batteries. Major loss of energy.
Thedudeabides803
Thedudeabides803 Hace un mes
Solar panels are made using petroleum in many ways. They have a large carbon footprint to be manufactured.
joji powell
joji powell Hace 27 días
Overall, what he said is common sense to people who understand automobiles and technology. He misses the same point he made with the electric cars with going to renewable energy: batteries. You still need batteries to store said energy when the sun isn't shining or the wind isn't blowing. That will cause even bigger C02 emissions and resource use when trying to produce batteries large enough to store that renewable energy and try to produce batteries for electric vehicles.
Xbye
Xbye Hace 27 días
The problem with "renewable energy" sources is also something to take into consideration. Solar panels need replacing, and windmills need maintenance/repairs. This things do not come from "zero emission" sources either. So no, they aren't renewable because eventually we'll run out of resources to maintenance. I also want to add, the amount of clear space needed for "renewable energy" can severely limit housing and as well displace wild life or even harm wild life (Check how many birds are killed by windmills). We need to find REAL renewable energy sources, with zero to minimal emissions. Something that would be REALLY important until we find that, would be nuclear power, which has made a lot improvements. It's become safer, more long lasting, and even mostly recyclable. It's far less taxing on our environment, space wise and emission wise.
adam rushing
adam rushing Hace 18 días
@C T Absolutely. There were several issues surrounding that disaster...none of them actually because of the dangers of the reaction itself. To list just a few: 1) Basically everything stems from this one - Due to the violent nature of Stalin's regime, no one was brave enough to report any issues, as it was likely to be perceived as a weakness on their part and they would probably "disappear". 2) They graphene tipped the rods - which helps with conductivity...basically making everything happen faster. 3) Chernobyl was undersized. So, instead of throttling with the correct methods, they would lift the insolating rods little by little until they got enough umph out of the reactor. For those reading this that may not know - that is exactly how you get a runaway reaction. You should NEVER remove, even slightly, an insolating rod...they are in place precisely to prevent the runaway. Combining the graphene tipping with their "throttling" method, and you're begging for a problem. There are plenty more issues, but that's enough for this lol
adam rushing
adam rushing Hace 20 días
@MikeLifeCrisis Huh...Okay. As long as those numbers are correct and our biologists don't see a decline in numbers, then that makes perfect sense. You men have successfully changed someone's mind...and in a YT comments section no less! Mark it on the calendar, because these days that doesn't happen very often! lol Thanks for clearing that up for me.
MikeLifeCrisis
MikeLifeCrisis Hace 20 días
@adam rushing It's more like a million birds killed every year by wind turbines in the US. But compare that to 200 million by vehicles, 800 million by windows, or 2.4 billion from cats, it's somewhat negligible.
Sam Khalil
Sam Khalil Hace 24 días
@adam rushing thanks....can't really go for the wind option on my property. live in a crowded city.
Michael T
Michael T Hace 2 meses
Well said. We really need to think about how to do this and I do believe there are sound ways to this without all the ideological stuff currently associated with climate change technologies. Let's figure out how to truly science the heck out of this problem.
Palatus Games
Palatus Games Hace 2 meses
@Sfs 🤡
Matthew Anderson
Matthew Anderson Hace un mes
Don't you have the same misconception with renewable energy sources? How much CO2 does it take to make a fossil fuel power plant vs. a wind farm that can output the same amount of power?
Vic G
Vic G Hace un mes
Great talk and worth looking at for sure where most of the time we don't do that. It's like investigating a work place accident. One must go all the way up the top of the safety pyramid to get to root cause and only then can a conversation about what safety actions can be done.
casey braley
casey braley Hace 2 días
Very thought provoking indeed. Enjoyably so...But...China, India and Russia wont be on board with any of this for a long long time..>50 years I imagine .So that is problematic.
Rusty
Rusty Hace un mes
We need more of those big machines that turn CO2 into something useful like wood.
Dean G
Dean G Hace un mes
@Rusty So that's one small forest. Better start planting then.
Rusty
Rusty Hace un mes
@jjhpor I worked at a lens factory. They did the calculations. It takes thousands of trees to keep up with a factory.
jjhpor
jjhpor Hace un mes
Trees, you mean. Yes, plant a tree.
Petey Hop
Petey Hop Hace 2 meses
I'd like to see him go into the carbon footprint of the production and lifespan of solar and wind powered sources. never mind the recyclability of them or lack of.
Daniel Smith
Daniel Smith Hace 3 días
@J4Zonian the article is a non-starter. It fails to address the fact that solar and wind requires vast amounts of land to supply our energy needs and fails to address the fact that mining for rare earths is by far the dirtiest way to produce energy. It also fails to address the fact that over 80% of rare earths are resourced from Countries (specifically China) that are belligerent towards the US and our allies.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace 4 días
@Daniel Smith "Correcting Anti-Renewable Energy Propaganda" cleantechnica 2/9/2020
Daniel Smith
Daniel Smith Hace 16 días
@J4ZonianActually "clean energy" is a misnomer. There's absolutely nothing clean about solar or wind energy. Mining for the necessary metals to manufature solar panels and modern wind turbines is by far the filthiest way to produce energy. Then there's the added fact that to produce enough energy to sustain even our current population vast amounts of farm land would have to be taken out of agricultural production which will only exacerbate the world's current food supply shortage and cause even higher inflation for agricultural products. Then there's the added fact that nearly 90% of all rare earths are mined in China or Russia with China being by far the largest supplier of rare earths, it isn't even a contest. Making our energy needs reliant upon the whims of adversarial governments could very easily be considered an act of treason under the Constitution especially when we have an vast supply of energy that can be produced domestically.
Joel Olsder
Joel Olsder Hace un mes
Whilst his points are mostly true in the U.S this is due to change as energy production sources change and this also isn't the same in other countries. Most owners of electric vehicles in Australia, charge their cars with solar power from their own roof tops. In these cases EVs are far better for the planet. There are several other facts not included in this presentation: EVs are responsible for considerably lower emissions over their lifetime than conventional (internal combustion engine) vehicles across Europe as a whole. However, as countries decarbonise electricity generation to meet their climate targets, driving emissions will fall for existing EVs and manufacturing emissions will fall for new EVs. In the UK in 2019, the lifetime emissions per kilometre of driving a Nissan Leaf EV were about three times lower than for the average conventional car, even before accounting for the falling carbon intensity of electricity generation during the car’s lifetime. Comparisons between electric vehicles and conventional vehicles are complex. They depend on the size of the vehicles, the accuracy of the fuel-economy estimates used, how electricity emissions are calculated, what driving patterns are assumed, and even the weather in regions where the vehicles are used. There is no single estimate that applies everywhere.
Lisa
Lisa Hace un mes
Thorium or Fusion Reactors to power the electric cars. Also, the heavy heat from reactors can be used in manufacturing rather than natural gas to make electric batteries, which would then make the entire system zero emissions from power to manufacturing for electric vehicles.
Arboza liyan
Arboza liyan Hace un mes
Electricity is used and transported much more efficiently. More than half of the energy produced with fuel goes to waste on the other hand it is the opposite for electricity.
Bozo Clown
Bozo Clown Hace un mes
You've missed the point of not looking at the entire cost basis /220720
Arboza liyan
Arboza liyan Hace un mes
@Jay Bee I think you are talking about plasma reactor motor. Paıl Pantone invented it back in 19 something. Its patents died a couple of years ago. He says that it would improve fueled engine efficiency multiple times. Nobody cared for some reason. Not an mechanic engineer so don't know the specifics but it looks legit
Jay Bee
Jay Bee Hace un mes
you are correct sir. 80% of the gas that goes into a gas powered car goes up in smoke or boiled off as heat. 70% for a diesel- which is why big oil funded the whole "green diesel" krap... they wanted to TAKE AWAY the efficiency advantage that diesels held over gas. in stationary power- if you utilize waste heat recovery- you can gain a lot of that wasted energy back- but THAT is just another reason why electricity is better- hybrid power plants use the waste heat to make steam and then use the steam for municipal heating of water & air systems.
id
id Hace 24 días
A hybrid is still more complex with more materials required. Continue to refine combustion engines to use less fuel, smaller cars, less cars... Can't stop the hunger for new and different and the products continue to be made, for more and more people. Where it will end up no one really knows.
Vox Templar
Vox Templar Hace 2 meses
The breakdown of why electric vehicles are bad for the environment is solid and on point. The only problem with the presentation is his only solution being renewable energy sources without examining how large of a footprint you'd need for solar farms, the rare metals involved in their creation. And for windfarms: they're loud, they are an ecological disaster to manufacture and produce and are not able to be recycled. He should have mentioned nuclear energy. It's 100% free of carbon emissions and doesn't rely on the sun or the wind.
MetalSandman999
MetalSandman999 Hace 23 días
@Andrew McQueen no means of energy production is zero-emmission when we factor in the CO2 produced in the manufacturing process. It takes a lot of energy and creates a lot of C02 to refine fuel for nuclear power just as it takes a lot of energy to build those plants, or to build solar fars, or to build massive wind turbines.
TeraMedia
TeraMedia Hace un mes
@ForzaJersey The intermittence problem with both wind and solar requires some type of energy storage solution, or else a backup energy production solution. That's all. Either NG or nuclear can offer that, provided there is some type of carryover power source. I disagree that wind and solar produce "industrial wastelands". I would argue the contrary that in places like Louisiana, it is the fossil fuel industry that has turned the environment into an industrial wasteland. Indeed, they have an area that they've nicknamed "cancer alley" due to the high incidence rate. All that said, if you have a better solution to offer, make your claim. You could save the future of humanity and make a killing in the process.
TeraMedia
TeraMedia Hace un mes
@patrick771 You know what else destroys beautiful landscapes? flooding Smog wildfires desertification oil spills I bet that Tuvalu really likes their landscape now better than they will when our selfish insistence on not trying to reduce our collective footprint will ultimately cause the climate change that submerges their entire island nation underwater.
Brad Haines
Brad Haines Hace un mes
@No Representation you didnt. because like i said, there are already lines across the atlantic. i didnt aay i will, you're just acting like its not possible when its already been done many times
Aron Eaton
Aron Eaton Hace un mes
While you're at it you might want to include the energy required and the pollution produced in the manufacturing of solar panels in your analysis.
Jonathan Showman
Jonathan Showman Hace 27 días
Yeah... Ironically solar and wind are worse than electric vehicles because of the cost to build and maintain, with little energy profit. Plus the transition to nuclear will make them obsolete. Only issue is a fuel is still a good idea for cars due to transportability and its energy density.
AllCreaturesCount
AllCreaturesCount Hace 29 días
It takes about 38lbs of coal to generate the electricity to drive a Tesla 100 miles. Coal and natural gas are the 2 most popular firms of generating electricity in the US. This is based on a Tesla using 34kw per 100 miles x 1.12lbs of coal to generate a single kw of electricity. Does that sound like zero emissions?
AllCreaturesCount
AllCreaturesCount Hace 28 días
@Video Superhero You are assuming most EV vehicles are in CA? Where are the stats on that? How would that help other states anyway? Im not against EV, I just don't agree with the lies being spread about the zero emissions. We also have failing electrical grids and they want to overload them with EV vehicles. Fact is that it takes more fossil fuels and energy to make and run an EV vehicle based on current stats. The future may be different but they can't get away with lies.
Video Superhero
Video Superhero Hace 28 días
@AllCreaturesCount i think my point is...most tesla's and ev's are in california..which does not use coal and is headed in the direction of more and more renewables. So the idea tha "ev's" today are using coal as an energy source is just..false information to try gaslight people. Most of the EV usage is in states that use renewables. Additionally...coal is now wayyy more expensive than renewables..the idea that the baseline of electricity is coming from coal is again..ridiculous and not even a real argument. Coal as an energy source is accelerating...so just stop with the coal argument. Additionally this guy in his presentation left out the emission and toxic spillage created when drilling/refining gasoline...but left them in when calculating creating a battery...again ridiculous...agreed? Plus...with a gas car..the issue isn't just co2..its alot of other materials that people are breating in via proximity vs ev's, if using a "burn" source not being so close to the burn. The argument this guy makes...just full of holes.
AllCreaturesCount
AllCreaturesCount Hace 28 días
@Video Superhero Natural gas is the leading source of electricity in the US. Coal is #2. Look it up. US Energy Info Administration stats.
Video Superhero
Video Superhero Hace 28 días
what % of tesla's on the road today are in state where coal is the primary energy source...probably a very important thing to understand for the context of your math..right?
privettoli
privettoli Hace un mes
Just check where electricity in your state comes from, if it's green, go for fully-electric.
Jerremy Morgan
Jerremy Morgan Hace 16 días
Real logic takes research, which equals much time and effort in studying data. Then, it takes a commitment to buck the sound bites and politics and to show the truth. We all agree that we would like the Earth to remain habitable in the future. Let us get there smartly.
fang151
fang151 Hace un mes
What about the CO2 from producing the windmills and solar panels. I am sure there is a lot going into those processes. Need to figure that into the equation also, along with constructing the sites, and repairing, removing at end of life. Then what are we going to do with the materials? I know fiberglass is not easily recycled. How about the cells for solar?
Kor Kiley
Kor Kiley Hace 26 días
I am very skeptical of Conway’s message. What he says is nothing new. I’ve heard variations of the same argument numerous times. He makes no attempt to cite the sources for the data he uses. Of course EV infrastructure is far from perfect and all thinking people know that EVs still pollute in various ways. However the top EV producers with Tesla in the vanguard are constantly working on these problems. Battery technology is progressing rapidly now and the grid is becoming more and more green. Big oil would love it if we were to turn our focus back to continued use of ICE vehicles, hybrid or not. The EV industry is pushing change where the internal combustion engine industry in partnership with the oil industry is desperately trying to stand still while continuing to be profitable. I tried to do some research on Southwest Research Institute. I didn’t learn a lot specific but they say they are funded by Government and Commercial entities. How much funding comes from the oil industry and auto manufacturers and might Conway have funding from these entities? I don’t know, but I AM skeptical.
Thomas Hammel
Thomas Hammel Hace un mes
The journey to Green is a transformation. This transformation includes the journey of the electric companies to gradually become greener, coal is being phased out and renewables are increasing. This will increase the efficiency year over year. The transformation of the battery is also a journey, this technology is also improving year over year. To answer your question, I would not push that button. I would however start to transform because if we don't start, we will never reach our goal to clean energy. Coal & fossil fuel reduction is a reality that is taking place today. I make a hobby of tracking it. It's beautiful to see. We just need to move faster.
Andrew Roland
Andrew Roland Hace 2 meses
It’s worse than he’s saying because he’s omitted the enormous amount of new global infrastructure required to get enough electric stations around the world. The oil/plastic coated cabling alone would run into millions of miles.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace un mes
@William Owen Recycle. Deal with it.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace un mes
@Lyle ONeal No. Solar & wind are many times better than fuels. Like EVs the up front energy & emissions are more than made up for by using no fuels. And once there are no fuels used in making them, as some are getting close to, the difference will be even bigger.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace un mes
@virtual-adam No. Stop lying about climate catastrophe.
J4Zonian
J4Zonian Hace un mes
@Jim Dennison And from wind, hydro, geothermal, tidal, solar + storage, & other sources. So far we get most of our energy from fuels. That's changing, though too slowly. Should be faster. Try to help with that instead of hindering.
Vollmilch Joghurt
Vollmilch Joghurt Hace un mes
CO2 for manufacturing the electric vehicle depends on the manufacturer. some are already using co2 neutral production of some parts by using solar and wind etc. so the amount of co2 per electric car is individual per manufacturer. so its not that clear as stated in this video.
Coues Pursuit
Coues Pursuit Hace un mes
And tell us about the elements mined for the battery and the battery production, how clean is that process. EV car manufacturing does not account for the battery manufacturing.
Mathias M
Mathias M Hace 28 días
Recycling batterys also lower the co2 production for the new batterys
S Gordon
S Gordon Hace un mes
Good start but as said below keeping an old vehicle running is far better than scrapping it. Manufacturing processes of the vehicle are also costly. I have an ebike now and hardly use my car any more!
PlayfullySound
PlayfullySound Hace un mes
It’s not about emissions produced, it’s about emissions recycled long term. CO2 recapture already happening but then again deserts are greening so could use a little more clean emissions.
Damian DeLapp
Damian DeLapp Hace un mes
He’s right about 90% of it, but in reality we need highly efficient nuclear reactors.
Micha Vermeer
Micha Vermeer Hace 3 días
Specifically, nuclear.
winston adair
winston adair Hace 24 días
GO THE HYBRED WAY
Rock Mogul
Rock Mogul Hace 27 días
This guy needs to watch the TED video on renewables.
Eric Callender
Eric Callender Hace 25 días
I hate to say it but, people who complain that electric vehicles are not good because they are powered by fossil fuel seem to forget that that's the same electricity that they use in their homes.
Siguiente